Silverish colored horse? Not grey

[Sunken Hill Stables]

Hey guys, I've been gone for a bit. Ran into life issues as well as a hard organizational spot in my breeding program.

Anyways, I've been meaning to ask about this horse. I don't know anything about champagne or how that works so... help? I'd love to understand the color and be able to repeat it.

[meganamber]

Hey guys, I've been gone for a bit. Ran into life issues as well as a hard organizational spot in my breeding program.

Anyways, I've been meaning to ask about this horse. I don't know anything about champagne or how that works so... help? I'd love to understand the color and be able to repeat it.

I know the horse has two cream genes and a champagne on top of her base coat. I'm thinking she is bay since both her parents are, but I don't know for sure. She may also have a silver in there too.

[Sunken Hill Stables]

Hey guys, I've been gone for a bit. Ran into life issues as well as a hard organizational spot in my breeding program.

Anyways, I've been meaning to ask about this horse. I don't know anything about champagne or how that works so... help? I'd love to understand the color and be able to repeat it.

I know the horse has two cream genes and a champagne on top of her base coat. I'm thinking she is bay since both her parents are, but I don't know for sure. She may also have a silver in there too.

Thanks. That's pretty much what I was thinking (minus silver because I don't know much about it). I just don't understand how the champagne created the silver color. Do you also know the name of the color?

[meganamber]

I know the horse has two cream genes and a champagne on top of her base coat. I'm thinking she is bay since both her parents are, but I don't know for sure. She may also have a silver in there too.

Thanks. That's pretty much what I was thinking (minus silver because I don't know much about it). I just don't understand how the champagne created the silver color. Do you also know the name of the color?

If her base coat was bay she would be a Amber Cream Champagne, as long as she doesn't have silver as well...

[Silverine]

Hey guys, I've been gone for a bit. Ran into life issues as well as a hard organizational spot in my breeding program.

Anyways, I've been meaning to ask about this horse. I don't know anything about champagne or how that works so... help? I'd love to understand the color and be able to repeat it.

I know the horse has two cream genes and a champagne on top of her base coat. I'm thinking she is bay since both her parents are, but I don't know for sure. She may also have a silver in there too.

She does not have silver. Both parents are bay based with no silver, so there is no place for her to have received a silver from.

Dustpelt (the sire) is Amber Cream - bay + champagne + 1xcream. He has bay, black, and chestnut based foals. That means he is E+/e and A/a - a bay base with hidden black and recessive red. Jordan's Tin Light (the dam) is perlino - bay + 2xcream. Her only other foal is a buckskin, so we can't get any other information from that foal but her sire is Palomino. That means she is E+/e, and her agouti gene can be either A/A, A/at, or A/a.

So what's going on with Tin Pelt? The only dilutions she can possibly have are cream and champagne as neither parent has silver, pearl, dun, or roan. We know she has champagne because of the mottling on her muzzle. We know she is double cream because of her blue-ish gray eyes. So how do we know what her base color is? First thing I look at is the general 'overtone' of the coat - this mare is much for blue-ish gray than I'd expect to see on a bay or chestnut coat. She is also much more uniformly colored than the majority of bay-based horses - there's usually at least some variation between body and leg color, and this girl has none.

So that leaves black and brown. The quickest and easiest way to check for this is to look at her foal picture. Her color as a newborn is nearly identical to her adult color. If she were brown she would have been much more yellow as a foal. Instead she has the typical blue-ish gray color of a black-based foal.

So the tl;dr: She's Classic Smokey Cream - black + 2xcream + champagne.

[Sunken Hill Stables]

If her base coat was bay she would be a Amber Cream Champagne, as long as she doesn't have silver as well...

Thank you so much!

[Sunken Hill Stables]

I know the horse has two cream genes and a champagne on top of her base coat. I'm thinking she is bay since both her parents are, but I don't know for sure. She may also have a silver in there too.

She does not have silver. Both parents are bay based with no silver, so there is no place for her to have received a silver from.

Dustpelt (the sire) is Amber Cream - bay + champagne + 1xcream. He has bay, black, and chestnut based foals. That means he is E+/e and A/a - a bay base with hidden black and recessive red. Jordan's Tin Light (the dam) is perlino - bay + 2xcream. Her only other foal is a buckskin, so we can't get any other information from that foal but her sire is Palomino. That means she is E+/e, and her agouti gene can be either A/A, A/at, or A/a.

So what's going on with Tin Pelt? The only dilutions she can possibly have are cream and champagne as neither parent has silver, pearl, dun, or roan. We know she has champagne because of the mottling on her muzzle. We know she is double cream because of her blue-ish gray eyes. So how do we know what her base color is? First thing I look at is the general 'overtone' of the coat - this mare is much for blue-ish gray than I'd expect to see on a bay or chestnut coat. She is also much more uniformly colored than the majority of bay-based horses - there's usually at least some variation between body and leg color, and this girl has none.

So that leaves black and brown. The quickest and easiest way to check for this is to look at her foal picture. Her color as a newborn is nearly identical to her adult color. If she were brown she would have been much more yellow as a foal. Instead she has the typical blue-ish gray color of a black-based foal.

So the tl;dr: She's Classic Smokey Cream - black + 2xcream + champagne.

TON of info! This is so valuable for me! Thank you so much. It really helps with the thought process of trying to understand the dilutions!

I was pretty set on bay because I've had that Dam's line for a while. I thought the uniformity was weird but I've also got a very light Perlino.

Thanks again!

[Silverine]

TON of info! This is so valuable for me! Thank you so much. It really helps with the thought process of trying to understand the dilutions!

I was pretty set on bay because I've had that Dam's line for a while. I thought the uniformity was weird but I've also got a very light Perlino.

Thanks again!

I'm glad it was helpful. I like laying out my process rather than just saying flat out, both to help people learn how to decipher color and so that people can point out where I might have gone wrong on the trickier horses.

Those hidden genes can really get you. Even if you breed two A/a's or A/at's together, there's still only a 25% chance that the foal will pop out black or brown, so even if a horse has all bay foals you can't really be sure there isn't an a or an at there without genetic testing.

[Sunken Hill Stables]

TON of info! This is so valuable for me! Thank you so much. It really helps with the thought process of trying to understand the dilutions!

I was pretty set on bay because I've had that Dam's line for a while. I thought the uniformity was weird but I've also got a very light Perlino.

Thanks again!

I'm glad it was helpful. I like laying out my process rather than just saying flat out, both to help people learn how to decipher color and so that people can point out where I might have gone wrong on the trickier horses.

Those hidden genes can really get you. Even if you breed two A/a's or A/at's together, there's still only a 25% chance that the foal will pop out black or brown, so even if a horse has all bay foals you can't really be sure there isn't an a or an at there without genetic testing.

It really does help. As you explained everything it all started making sense. Thank you for doing that for me and the community!

His color genes are a bit all over the place as I was breeding him for type. I did not expect a "silver looking" horse to pop out. Even the combo of his parents names worked with his coat well. The game can be pretty surprising and fun like that. I had one horse I was pretty sure was going to come out with a large lp pattern. Nope completely solid lol. Genes are fun.