Foundation Breed Demand

[Bumble_Bee]

North African Barbs are needed by everyone and their dog.
Forest Horses are freaking cute and the least populous of the 3 'finalists'.
Turkmenes are pretty. SO PRETTY.

I feel so indecisive...

My opinion, if it helps any...

The only reason you list for North African Barbs is other people, you don't list any interest in them yourself. Be careful about swinging too far to the other end of the pendulum. It's not fun long-term to breed only for other people, just like it's not fun long-term to breed only for yourself.

Forest Horses are cute, and if you breed ones with feathering (if you like that) you'd stand out even more. The fact that they're the least populous, if you're anything like me, would make them even more fun.

Turkmenes, I agree, they're pretty little things. What about them do you find pretty? Is it something you can bring over to Forest Horses, like their color or metallic? Or is it something specific to them like their body shape? I ask because I'm currently in the process of crossing Turkmenes into my Belgians for this reason. Shiny, colored Belgians are the best of both worlds for me. Would shiny colored Forest Horses be the best of both worlds for you? Maybe, maybe not. It's just a thought.

[kidhedera]

Oh, there's things I personally like about the NABs too. The frequency with which they display tiger eyes, their fairly neutral 'horsey' shape, the variety of colours they come in without needing to cross in other breeds. I suspect the things I like about them are the reason they are needed by so many people!

I've been trying to keep in mind that in the end, its my breeding program, so I have to do what I like with it.

So anyway, what I've decided is that I'm going to breed Forest Horses with feathers (for usefulness to draft breeders), initially just trying to pump up their stats a little, before breeding in some nice colours from North African Barbs (cos they are a bit heavier than a turkmene). When I have more room on my farm I may start a smaller secondary NAB and/or Turkmene breeding program.

Now I just have to try to get a hold of some Forest Horses with feathers! (I'd also like to breed a line of black feathered Forest Horses for friesian breeders to use).

[Bumble_Bee]

Oh, there's things I personally like about the NABs too. The frequency with which they display tiger eyes [snip]

Maybe you can bring those over to your Forest Horses, too. That's also in my plans for Belgians, trying to get non-champagne colors with two copies of the tiger eye gene so it shows. So many cool things that can be done... I'll be busy for quite a while.

I'd also like to breed a line of black feathered Forest Horses for friesian breeders to use.

Good idea there, I hadn't thought of that.

If there isn't one already, we might like to have a discussion post for breeders of any foundation breed. You and I are doing different breeds but yet we're doing close enough to the same thing that I'm really curious to watch your progress, and it'd be fun to talk to people who are doing the other foundation breeds.

[kidhedera]

If there isn't one already, we might like to have a discussion post for breeders of any foundation breed. You and I are doing different breeds but yet we're doing close enough to the same thing that I'm really curious to watch your progress, and it'd be fun to talk to people who are doing the other foundation breeds.

I have to admit that I have been watching your farm log. There are definitely issues in common for breeding any foundation breed that could be discussed. (When do you add new stock from the adoption centre? When you do, how do you choose them? Are you aiming to fit the breed to its modern breed standard, or breeding it to fit the requirements of other breeders? or Both? How often do you add stock from other breeds? etc)

[Bumble_Bee]

I have to admit that I have been watching your farm log. There are definitely issues in common for breeding any foundation breed that could be discussed. (When do you add new stock from the adoption centre? When you do, how do you choose them? Are you aiming to fit the breed to its modern breed standard, or breeding it to fit the requirements of other breeders? or Both? How often do you add stock from other breeds? etc)

Yes! So many questions. I've been treating each little project of mine as an experiment, handling each one differently and watching how the cards fall. I don't really view any of them as a failure because I've learned something from each one. But it'd be easier for me if I could learn from other people who are in similar situations, too.

One of the biggest things I wish I'd done differently is I wish I'd established a base first. I didn't think about stats or showing, and I didn't learn about body shapes, until after I'd started my color breeding. When I ended up with black Belgians with horrible movement stats or champagne Belgians that looked like hotdogs, I didn't know how to fix either of them. I didn't have a base to breed them back to.

[Demi]

I’ll be the first to vote for Caspians, than. I’m pretty new to HWO so I don’t really know if they get used for a lot of breeds, but I need them and noticed there are 1) only a few (good) studs available, 2) mostly bays.

[kidhedera]

I’ll be the first to vote for Caspians, than. I’m pretty new to HWO so I don’t really know if they get used for a lot of breeds, but I need them and noticed there are 1) only a few (good) studs available, 2) mostly bays.

Oh, sorry Daleeshi, I already decided I am going to breed Forest Horses.

Yes! So many questions. I've been treating each little project of mine as an experiment, handling each one differently and watching how the cards fall. I don't really view any of them as a failure because I've learned something from each one. But it'd be easier for me if I could learn from other people who are in similar situations, too.

One of the biggest things I wish I'd done differently is I wish I'd established a base first. I didn't think about stats or showing, and I didn't learn about body shapes, until after I'd started my color breeding. When I ended up with black Belgians with horrible movement stats or champagne Belgians that looked like hotdogs, I didn't know how to fix either of them. I didn't have a base to breed them back to.

I had something unexpected happen with my first crop of Forest foals... I bred my new stallion to ALL my mares. He had pretty poor stats, and one of the mares had even worse. The worst foal came from the best mare, and the best foal came from the worst mare! So I'm breeding the whole herd again to a different stallion and I'm going to be carefully watching to see what happens.

[Bumble_Bee]

I had something unexpected happen with my first crop of Forest foals... I bred my new stallion to ALL my mares. He had pretty poor stats, and one of the mares had even worse. The worst foal came from the best mare, and the best foal came from the worst mare! So I'm breeding the whole herd again to a different stallion and I'm going to be carefully watching to see what happens.

Stats can be so random with breeding, it drives me nuts. I do what you did, I call it "brute forcing it" lol. I breed one stallion to all of my mares over and over again, and I cull very selectively.

In my metallic line, I did a little experiment - I didn't focus on stats at all. I re-homed red stats, but other than that, I didn't even look at them. My metallic champagnes (well, most of them, not all) turned out with predictably horrible stats. But my metallic creams got really great stats, just as good as the line where I selectively bred for stats. *shrug* Okay then.

[kidhedera]

Stats can be so random with breeding, it drives me nuts. I do what you did, I call it "brute forcing it" lol. I breed one stallion to all of my mares over and over again, and I cull very selectively.

In my metallic line, I did a little experiment - I didn't focus on stats at all. I re-homed red stats, but other than that, I didn't even look at them. My metallic champagnes (well, most of them, not all) turned out with predictably horrible stats. But my metallic creams got really great stats, just as good as the line where I selectively bred for stats. *shrug* Okay then.

Its because the comments can 'lie'. For example, you can tell how much stamina a foal has by training it as a newborn. One of them with 'I'm surprised this foal can lift its head' was able to train more than one of the others with a much more positive comment. The only real way to be sure about a horses abilities is to 1. train them to test for stamina, 2. enter them in local competitions.

I'm trying to formulate a test I can perform when they are 6 months old to determine their abilities, but its hard because I'm not breeding for any particular discipline. I just want 'good general stats'. I'll figure something out tho.

[Bumble_Bee]

Its because the comments can 'lie'. For example, you can tell how much stamina a foal has by training it as a newborn. One of them with 'I'm surprised this foal can lift its head' was able to train more than one of the others with a much more positive comment. The only real way to be sure about a horses abilities is to 1. train them to test for stamina, 2. enter them in local competitions.

I'm trying to formulate a test I can perform when they are 6 months old to determine their abilities, but its hard because I'm not breeding for any particular discipline. I just want 'good general stats'. I'll figure something out tho.

Hmm, that's interesting. Keep me posted on what you figure out with this, please. I had one pair that both had average remarks (I can't remember what now) in speed but yet they repeatedly, every single breeding, gave me red speed. Negative speed I could understand, but red? Every time? That confused me.