Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
UGH!!! I never thought the age old thing about mares and stallions would ever come to HWO!!As a possible way to make geldings more appealing (once added), perhaps the following could be implemented:
1) Stallions have a 20% training and competition penalty. Mares have a 15% training and competition penalty. Geldings and sterilised mares have no penalties.
HOWEVER
A new course is implemented: riding ability (which does not affect geldings or sterilised mares). Riding ability reduces the training/showing penalty in stallions and mares (and is affected by who rides the horse; i.e., when jockeys are implemented, the jockeys riding ability is taken into account, not the owner's.) For example, at riding ability level 1, mares have a 10% training penalty, a 15% penalty in shows; stallions have a 15% training penalty and a 20% competition penalty. The training penalty goes down by 5% each level. Once the training penalty has hit zero, then the competition penalty goes down by 5% per level.
Riding ability does not grant bonuses; it just reduces the penalty.
2a) Stallions being ridden by handlers without a maxed stallion handling and riding ability skill have a small chance (determined by the level of stallion handling and riding ability) of their stallion 'getting loose' or misbehaving at a show and impregnating a mare there. (This does present a risk of causing negative feelings and fighting among players, 2b) would likely be a better idea, despite being less realistic)
3) A base personality can also be implemented, one that affects how the horse acts at shows, how easy they are to train, etc and has a positive and negative aspect to it. For example, a personality trait such as 'restless': these horses are more likely to kick, as such, horses in the paddock with them or horses at a show might be injured by this horse; this horse might also kick the walls of its stall and might injure itself - however, this horse has a lot of energy and is either fast or has a lot of stamina. Personality can be determined via the environment - the personalities of the other horses the foal is with, whether the foal was raised by itself or in a group, whether there was a fully grown horse in the area, if the foal was with its mother and whether the foal was in a stall or in a paddock. The personality is determined by, maybe 6 months? The personality can be affected, but not changed, by temperament. E.g. a bombproof, restless horse would be less likely to kick than a highly strung, restless horse.
4) Once ribbons are added, if one puts puts a red ribbon in the tail of a horse likely to kick (with a personality such as aggressive or restless) or a yellow one in a stallion, it reduces the chance of a negative incident happening at a show (due to people avoiding/respecting the horse's space).
On a scale of 1 'this is as bad an idea as putting pineapple on pizza' to 10 'this is the best idea since pizza', what do you think?
Edit:
2b) Stallions have a 5% chance of getting a 10% penalty at a show, as the rider's riding ability skill goes up, the penalty decreases to, eventually 1% and no lower; as the stallion handling ability is increased, the chance of getting the penalty decreases until it is, eventually, 0,2% and no lower.
Mares have a 5% chance of getting a 10% penalty, which goes down to a 1% chance of getting a 2% penalty; however,once riding ability is maxed, mares will have a 0,1% chance of getting an 10% bonus.
Geldings and sterilised mares both have a 2% chance of getting a 5% penalty BUT they also have a 2% chance of getting a 5% bonus. Geldings' and sterilised mares' bonuses do not increase nor decrease with riding ability.
5) If a stallion or mare is sterilised too late in life (say, 10 years old) there is a 5% chance the sterilisation will have no affect on their behaviour.
Tell me if you think these bonuses and penalties are too little or too much and what you think I should change it to.
I for one am totaly not ok this idea!! If it happens I would really think about leaving HWO!
Here is why:
1. Mares and stallions have a higher competeing average... They have hormones that make them driven, caring and passionate riding partiners!
2. Geldings have little to no "drive" and few are ever able to show to the top!
3. We enter in competitions, but don't show it them. This is a online virtual game... no stallion is going to run off and breed a mare in the "show"
4. The riding horse of choice for many show proffesionals, iis stallions or mares!
5. Mares are simple to control, they only get a bad rap because some are not good for the stupid pony ride string... why? Because they have character, and are very devoted to their owners, making it hard to respond well to random people!
6. I'm a young teen and my Ex-racing stallion is my best riding horse... my geldings are nice, but nothing like my mares and stallions!
I wouldn't mind there being geldings in HWO... a good thing for crummy colts that you don't want to ever be used for breeding. But no penelties please!! Mares, Stallions and Geldings have no difference. Geldings are just as dangrous as any other horse if not handled right!
And guess what? Mares & Stallions are more forgiving, sensitive to training and have better "feel" than most Geldings! And I have never seen a more messed up horse then the Sterilized mare that I owned!!
Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
I understand your points; the main goal for this is for there to be some added benefit to neutering horses.honeybunny wrote:
UGH!!! I never thought the age old thing about mares and stallions would ever come to HWO!!
I for one am totaly not ok this idea!! If it happens I would really think about leaving HWO!
Here is why:
1. Mares and stallions have a higher competeing average... They have hormones that make them driven, caring and passionate riding partiners!
2. Geldings have little to no "drive" and few are ever able to show to the top!
3. We enter in competitions, but don't show it them. This is a online virtual game... no stallion is going to run off and breed a mare in the "show"
4. The riding horse of choice for many show proffesionals, iis stallions or mares!
5. Mares are simple to control, they only get a bad rap because some are not good for the stupid pony ride string... why? Because they have character, and are very devoted to their owners, making it hard to respond well to random people!
6. I'm a young teen and my Ex-racing stallion is my best riding horse... my geldings are nice, but nothing like my mares and stallions!
I wouldn't mind there being geldings in HWO... a good thing for crummy colts that you don't want to ever be used for breeding. But no penelties please!! Mares, Stallions and Geldings have no difference. Geldings are just as dangrous as any other horse if not handled right!
And guess what? Mares & Stallions are more forgiving, sensitive to training and have better "feel" than most Geldings! And I have never seen a more messed up horse then the Sterilized mare that I owned!!
About hormones... well, your inexperienced rider is not going to have a good time with a stallion - this is allows riding ability/horsemanship to have a part in competition results whilst geldings and sterilised mares allow new players to have a chance at competition.
On sterilised mares - these are rare because of the risks associated with spaying such a large animal (1)(although there does appear to be a newer, less risky procedure (2)), so the chances of seeing one competing at a very high level is low. On sterilised mares being miserable, if I am to be frank, anecdotal evidence does not a fact make; however, I will say that I read an article relating to the neutering of dogs and the increased health risks and temperament changes due to that - this was, however, about dogs and I also cannot claim that the article was legitimate as it was not published by a reliable source (that I know of).
On point 3: this is a realistic virtual game. The purpose of the suggestion of accidental breeding was to enhance the realism.
On geldings being just as dangerous... don't I know it. I have a TB gelding who we suspect was formerly abused. Spooks at everything; has anxiety, can't concentrate... he's both gotten better and worse (better in that it's actually possible to get on him. He is worse in that he got a major fright when we competed nationally and now he refuses jumps (but only at competitions... go figure); he also goes into panic mode when we canter.) He also used to spook and back away if you lifted your hand even slightly, now he only flinches if you move too fast.
I have another gelding (he's retired now), absolutely no idea where this horse came from originally; he was a nutter under the saddle; sweet on the ground.
On points 2 and 4: in the 2004 Olympics for showjumping, 77 horses competed. 35 were geldings, 26 stallions and 16 mares(3).
On point 5: so is any horse, if it is trained well, has a good rider who wears spurs and carries a whip and the horse has a bar of metal shoved in its mouth. There are mares who get moodier/more aggressive when in season(4); and, quite frankly, I don't blame them; estrus is horrible.
The point, however, is that mares do become more difficult to handle at certain times and it is linked to hormone changes.
A bit of advice when formulating an opinion/argument:
Ensure that you have good spelling, grammar and punctuation.
Do not use anecdotal evidence as the be all end all.
Provide references to your arguments and facts.
Do not make 'threats'.
References:
(1) http://www.netvet.co.uk/equine/neuterin ... a-mare.htm
(2) https://www.pilchuckvet.com/articles/sh ... g-my-mare-
(3) http://www.tbheritage.com/HistoricSires ... c2004.html
(4) https://www.horseandrideruk.com/expert- ... bad-girls/
Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
LOL! I was tired, grumpy and had a bad horsey day... so my argument was not very clear!Malakai10 wrote:I understand your points; the main goal for this is for there to be some added benefit to neutering horses.honeybunny wrote:
UGH!!! I never thought the age old thing about mares and stallions would ever come to HWO!!
I for one am totaly not ok this idea!! If it happens I would really think about leaving HWO!
Here is why:
1. Mares and stallions have a higher competeing average... They have hormones that make them driven, caring and passionate riding partiners!
2. Geldings have little to no "drive" and few are ever able to show to the top!
3. We enter in competitions, but don't show it them. This is a online virtual game... no stallion is going to run off and breed a mare in the "show"
4. The riding horse of choice for many show proffesionals, iis stallions or mares!
5. Mares are simple to control, they only get a bad rap because some are not good for the stupid pony ride string... why? Because they have character, and are very devoted to their owners, making it hard to respond well to random people!
6. I'm a young teen and my Ex-racing stallion is my best riding horse... my geldings are nice, but nothing like my mares and stallions!
I wouldn't mind there being geldings in HWO... a good thing for crummy colts that you don't want to ever be used for breeding. But no penelties please!! Mares, Stallions and Geldings have no difference. Geldings are just as dangrous as any other horse if not handled right!
And guess what? Mares & Stallions are more forgiving, sensitive to training and have better "feel" than most Geldings! And I have never seen a more messed up horse then the Sterilized mare that I owned!!
About hormones... well, your inexperienced rider is not going to have a good time with a stallion - this is allows riding ability/horsemanship to have a part in competition results whilst geldings and sterilised mares allow new players to have a chance at competition.
On sterilised mares - these are rare because of the risks associated with spaying such a large animal (1)(although there does appear to be a newer, less risky procedure (2)), so the chances of seeing one competing at a very high level is low. On sterilised mares being miserable, if I am to be frank, anecdotal evidence does not a fact make; however, I will say that I read an article relating to the neutering of dogs and the increased health risks and temperament changes due to that - this was, however, about dogs and I also cannot claim that the article was legitimate as it was not published by a reliable source (that I know of).
On point 3: this is a realistic virtual game. The purpose of the suggestion of accidental breeding was to enhance the realism.
On geldings being just as dangerous... don't I know it. I have a TB gelding who we suspect was formerly abused. Spooks at everything; has anxiety, can't concentrate... he's both gotten better and worse (better in that it's actually possible to get on him. He is worse in that he got a major fright when we competed nationally and now he refuses jumps (but only at competitions... go figure); he also goes into panic mode when we canter.) He also used to spook and back away if you lifted your hand even slightly, now he only flinches if you move too fast.
I have another gelding (he's retired now), absolutely no idea where this horse came from originally; he was a nutter under the saddle; sweet on the ground.
On points 2 and 4: in the 2004 Olympics for showjumping, 77 horses competed. 35 were geldings, 26 stallions and 16 mares(3).
On point 5: so is any horse, if it is trained well, has a good rider who wears spurs and carries a whip and the horse has a bar of metal shoved in its mouth. There are mares who get moodier/more aggressive when in season(4); and, quite frankly, I don't blame them; estrus is horrible.
The point, however, is that mares do become more difficult to handle at certain times and it is linked to hormone changes.
A bit of advice when formulating an opinion/argument:
Ensure that you have good spelling, grammar and punctuation.
Do not use anecdotal evidence as the be all end all.
Provide references to your arguments and facts.
Do not make 'threats'.
References:
(1) http://www.netvet.co.uk/equine/neuterin ... a-mare.htm
(2) https://www.pilchuckvet.com/articles/sh ... g-my-mare-
(3) http://www.tbheritage.com/HistoricSires ... c2004.html
(4) https://www.horseandrideruk.com/expert- ... bad-girls/
As the happy owner of (currently) 11 mares, 5 stallions, 2 sterilized mares and 4 geldings I am quite willing to jump to the defense of my beloved intact horses. I am 25 and my best horse is my 25 year old TB stallion Warrior! (We grew up together)
My real argument:
1. Geldings are no safer than mares or stallions! All horses are potentially dangerous, gelding does not change that. However I agree that the beginner is not a good match for a stallion (In most cases) and some novices aren't even a good match some mares. However there are exceptions to this rule, like my beloved Arabian stallion "Ramose"(6 years of age), who is currently leased by a novice 10 year-old girl. This works, only because Ramose is a gentleman, both horse and rider bonded instantly.
2. Most sterilized mares that I have met are just like a normal mare, just one that never goes into season. But there are others that have suffered (performance wise) because of the sterilizing. My first sterilized mare, Bella, was diagnosed with a rare ovarian cancer and the only cure was to remove her ovaries, thus sterilizing her. Unfortunately, her once amazing performance suffered. This is due to her temperament. (She preformed best when in estrus, so when this was removed her drive to compete disappeared) But now she is a wonderful trail horse!
3. Some mares get grumpy and unhappy in estrus, while others are like my mare "Savannah" (Isn't She Perty... yes it is Perty not pretty!) are calm and relaxed all the way through estrus.
4. Some intact animals have better performance (like Bella) and some sterilized animals have equal performance. But I find that most the time your can not tell the difference between a intact horse and a sterilized or gelded animal, until you either look or ask! So my only concerns are:
1. This game can be pretty hard to understand/ get started in so maybe don't require special classes if you want to show stallions or mares.
2. Geldings should be allowed to compete alone and with intact animals.
3. A person can show a stallion if they are past level 3.
4. Stallion handling classes do duel duty, filling both stud and competition requirements.
5. Prices for stallions and mares (of any breed) should be higher then geldings and sterilized mares. Only because breeding animals can produce many foals in their lives making them more expensive!
6. This idea needs to be looked over many times to make sure that it is fun, fair and easily worked with for players or it could become very frustrating if you can't afford any stallion showing classes so you can get titles for your best horse.
My only concern is for it to be fun and fair. As well as been a game enhancer, not a limiter. Also the penalties may be unnecessary and a sad detraction from the game. If these things are met, I look forward with great interest to the arrival of geldings!!!
Thank you,
Honeybunny
P.S. This is my opinion not fully researched facts. And most is based on the experiences I have had. Others may have had different experiences. I hold a Bachelors degree in Animal Science and I am a equine vet. But I don't even think I know everything! So experiences differ. These are just my observations and the things I have noticed!
P.P.S. One of the main risks with the sterilizing procedure is the fact that the mare must be under anesthesia which is risky in large animals and equines!
Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
I understand the bad day, you have my sympathies :)honeybunny wrote:LOL! I was tired, grumpy and had a bad horsey day... so my argument was not very clear!Malakai10 wrote:
I understand your points; the main goal for this is for there to be some added benefit to neutering horses.
About hormones... well, your inexperienced rider is not going to have a good time with a stallion - this is allows riding ability/horsemanship to have a part in competition results whilst geldings and sterilised mares allow new players to have a chance at competition.
On sterilised mares - these are rare because of the risks associated with spaying such a large animal (1)(although there does appear to be a newer, less risky procedure (2)), so the chances of seeing one competing at a very high level is low. On sterilised mares being miserable, if I am to be frank, anecdotal evidence does not a fact make; however, I will say that I read an article relating to the neutering of dogs and the increased health risks and temperament changes due to that - this was, however, about dogs and I also cannot claim that the article was legitimate as it was not published by a reliable source (that I know of).
On point 3: this is a realistic virtual game. The purpose of the suggestion of accidental breeding was to enhance the realism.
On geldings being just as dangerous... don't I know it. I have a TB gelding who we suspect was formerly abused. Spooks at everything; has anxiety, can't concentrate... he's both gotten better and worse (better in that it's actually possible to get on him. He is worse in that he got a major fright when we competed nationally and now he refuses jumps (but only at competitions... go figure); he also goes into panic mode when we canter.) He also used to spook and back away if you lifted your hand even slightly, now he only flinches if you move too fast.
I have another gelding (he's retired now), absolutely no idea where this horse came from originally; he was a nutter under the saddle; sweet on the ground.
On points 2 and 4: in the 2004 Olympics for showjumping, 77 horses competed. 35 were geldings, 26 stallions and 16 mares(3).
On point 5: so is any horse, if it is trained well, has a good rider who wears spurs and carries a whip and the horse has a bar of metal shoved in its mouth. There are mares who get moodier/more aggressive when in season(4); and, quite frankly, I don't blame them; estrus is horrible.
The point, however, is that mares do become more difficult to handle at certain times and it is linked to hormone changes.
A bit of advice when formulating an opinion/argument:
Ensure that you have good spelling, grammar and punctuation.
Do not use anecdotal evidence as the be all end all.
Provide references to your arguments and facts.
Do not make 'threats'.
References:
(1) http://www.netvet.co.uk/equine/neuterin ... a-mare.htm
(2) https://www.pilchuckvet.com/articles/sh ... g-my-mare-
(3) http://www.tbheritage.com/HistoricSires ... c2004.html
(4) https://www.horseandrideruk.com/expert- ... bad-girls/
As the happy owner of (currently) 11 mares, 5 stallions, 2 sterilized mares and 4 geldings I am quite willing to jump to the defense of my beloved intact horses. I am 25 and my best horse is my 25 year old TB stallion Warrior! (We grew up together)
My real argument:
1. Geldings are no safer than mares or stallions! All horses are potentially dangerous, gelding does not change that. However I agree that the beginner is not a good match for a stallion (In most cases) and some novices aren't even a good match some mares. However there are exceptions to this rule, like my beloved Arabian stallion "Ramose"(6 years of age), who is currently leased by a novice 10 year-old girl. This works, only because Ramose is a gentleman, both horse and rider bonded instantly.
2. Most sterilized mares that I have met are just like a normal mare, just one that never goes into season. But there are others that have suffered (performance wise) because of the sterilizing. My first sterilized mare, Bella, was diagnosed with a rare ovarian cancer and the only cure was to remove her ovaries, thus sterilizing her. Unfortunately, her once amazing performance suffered. This is due to her temperament. (She preformed best when in estrus, so when this was removed her drive to compete disappeared) But now she is a wonderful trail horse!
3. Some mares get grumpy and unhappy in estrus, while others are like my mare "Savannah" (Isn't She Perty... yes it is Perty not pretty!) are calm and relaxed all the way through estrus.
4. Some intact animals have better performance (like Bella) and some sterilized animals have equal performance. But I find that most the time your can not tell the difference between a intact horse and a sterilized or gelded animal, until you either look or ask! So my only concerns are:
1. This game can be pretty hard to understand/ get started in so maybe don't require special classes if you want to show stallions or mares.
2. Geldings should be allowed to compete alone and with intact animals.
3. A person can show a stallion if they are past level 3.
4. Stallion handling classes do duel duty, filling both stud and competition requirements.
5. Prices for stallions and mares (of any breed) should be higher then geldings and sterilized mares. Only because breeding animals can produce many foals in their lives making them more expensive!
6. This idea needs to be looked over many times to make sure that it is fun, fair and easily worked with for players or it could become very frustrating if you can't afford any stallion showing classes so you can get titles for your best horse.
My only concern is for it to be fun and fair. As well as been a game enhancer, not a limiter. Also the penalties may be unnecessary and a sad detraction from the game. If these things are met, I look forward with great interest to the arrival of geldings!!! :D :D
Thank you,
Honeybunny
P.S. This is my opinion not fully researched facts. And most is based on the experiences I have had. Others may have had different experiences. I hold a Bachelors degree in Animal Science and I am a equine vet. But I don't even think I know everything! So experiences differ. These are just my observations and the things I have noticed! :D
P.P.S. One of the main risks with the sterilizing procedure is the fact that the mare must be under anesthesia which is risky in large animals and equines!
That makes sense. Maybe the personality and temperament can play more of a roll? For example: a bombproof, 'sweet' (if a new base personality is added) stallion can be handled completely by level three; however, a highly strung, 'aggressive' stallion can only be handled at level twenty.
I get the whole not wanting penalties; and I both want to agree with you and I also don't... I'm not sure how to explain it. Like... let's take The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim.
So, in Skyrim, there's a thing called a Thu'um, essentially, Shouting to change the make up of the universe to your own will. Lore-wise (some of this is speculation (theoretically, a Thu'um can do anything (this isn't, however, explicitly stated (to my knowledge))), one can Shout continuously - one can slow time to a halt, run with the speed of a whirlwind, emblazon one's blade with the fury of the elements, make oneself intangible. Game-wise (in unmodded Skyrim and when one doesn't use cheats), there is a cool-down period between Shouts that depends on which Thu'um one uses as well as the number of words in the Thu'um (Shouts are made of a maximum of three words and syllables with one exception). One can slow time (but not stop it), sprint a one-hundred metres maximum in less than a second, sharpen and quicken one's blade(s) (as long as it isn't enchanted) and make it so that one can neither harm nor be harmed (but one can't pass through solid objects.) You can reduce Shout cool down (but not eliminate) by about 20% by wearing an Amulet of Talos.
Why is game-play so different from lore? Why is the Thu'um nerfed? The differences, the penalties, keep the game challenging and interesting. They give further goals and penalties. It's getting as close as possible to realism whilst still trying to keep it fair. One can't have something super powerful in a game without giving it a penalty.
If neutering has either a negative or no effect on the horse, it reduces the number of neutered horses. If neutering is only done to stop the horse breeding, then it would likely be because the horse's genes are bad; if the horse is too bad to breed and too bad to compete, why even have them at all? What value will geldings have?
The bonuses and penalties I suggested are to allow two options: low risk with consistent, moderate reward and high risk with inconsistent, high reward.
PS: I just want to make it clear - I'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to explain my way of seeing it.
PPS: Also, quick question, in your first post on this topic, you called yourself a 'young teen' and then you said you have a Bachelors degree in Animal Science and are an equine vet? I'm simply confused about the inconsistency in those statements.
PPPS: I don't feel like finding the references for the Skyrim stuff; if you're into Skyrim and you want the references, ask and I'll find them.
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Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 12:41 am Posts: 11111 Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
Games, although paralleling reality, do need to be slightly offset to it in some instances, for both gameplay and fun.Malakai10 wrote:...honeybunny wrote:...
Like I'm sure I've said before, there will always be exceptions to rules.
In my opinions:
The breed arabian (likely with some other breeds, but this one I have specific experience with), will offer horse exceptions more often then not. As in, one could likely feel safe leaving their children or themselves in the full care of a stallion or mare and not expect to be hurt when doing something stupid.
Thoroughbreds however, I don't like, even to this day and won't choose to ride one unless it's been altered.
So I feel very differently when discussing certain factors with certain breeds. I will offer entirely different answers to certain questions when specifics are discussed.
I prefer stallions over any other type of horse, but it takes a particular type of stallion with certain types of raising and instruction and of COURSE personality in order to be 'safe' around them. Yet I appear to get along best with geldings, go figure. Mares and I have mixed outcomes and it really comes down to the personality of the horse (yet, not one type of personality can I describe for a mare, that I will get along with).
******
There really hasn't been much community involvement on this topic so either the community is nominally happy with what's been discussed or they don't really care.
So, personally, I'd like to get some additional opinions from anybody that's following:
Please Vote:
1) Altering (sterilized mares & geldings) with benefits for them (as has been discussed, or with some sort of benefits herein unnamed).
Votes so far: 9
2) Altering without benefits (just the ability to not have offspring).
Votes so far: 3
3) No altering, leave the game unchanged.
Votes so far: 0
4) Abstain/Don't Care/Choose Not To Say.
Votes so far: 0
Total votes counted: 12
This with the understanding that nothing has been decided and we will still be at the final decision of our admins.
Noting that votes are also being collected from the following linked topic made to bring more attention to this discussion: http://www.horseworldonline.net/forum/v ... 44#p114944
I will attempt my best to not double count votes. I can do little about a player voting across multiple accounts though.
Last edited by BlackOak2 on Thu Jun 20, 2019 8:37 pm, edited 13 times in total.
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Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 12:41 am Posts: 11111 Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
Forgot to put my own vote...
Definitely 1
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Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
For me it is 2
Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
"Also, quick question, in your first post on this topic, you called yourself a 'young teen' and then you said you have a Bachelors degree in Animal Science and are an equine vet? I'm simply confused about the inconsistency in those statements."Malakai10 wrote:I understand the bad day, you have my sympathieshoneybunny wrote:
LOL! I was tired, grumpy and had a bad horsey day... so my argument was not very clear!
As the happy owner of (currently) 11 mares, 5 stallions, 2 sterilized mares and 4 geldings I am quite willing to jump to the defense of my beloved intact horses. I am 25 and my best horse is my 25 year old TB stallion Warrior! (We grew up together)
My real argument:
1. Geldings are no safer than mares or stallions! All horses are potentially dangerous, gelding does not change that. However I agree that the beginner is not a good match for a stallion (In most cases) and some novices aren't even a good match some mares. However there are exceptions to this rule, like my beloved Arabian stallion "Ramose"(6 years of age), who is currently leased by a novice 10 year-old girl. This works, only because Ramose is a gentleman, both horse and rider bonded instantly.
2. Most sterilized mares that I have met are just like a normal mare, just one that never goes into season. But there are others that have suffered (performance wise) because of the sterilizing. My first sterilized mare, Bella, was diagnosed with a rare ovarian cancer and the only cure was to remove her ovaries, thus sterilizing her. Unfortunately, her once amazing performance suffered. This is due to her temperament. (She preformed best when in estrus, so when this was removed her drive to compete disappeared) But now she is a wonderful trail horse!
3. Some mares get grumpy and unhappy in estrus, while others are like my mare "Savannah" (Isn't She Perty... yes it is Perty not pretty!) are calm and relaxed all the way through estrus.
4. Some intact animals have better performance (like Bella) and some sterilized animals have equal performance. But I find that most the time your can not tell the difference between a intact horse and a sterilized or gelded animal, until you either look or ask! So my only concerns are:
1. This game can be pretty hard to understand/ get started in so maybe don't require special classes if you want to show stallions or mares.
2. Geldings should be allowed to compete alone and with intact animals.
3. A person can show a stallion if they are past level 3.
4. Stallion handling classes do duel duty, filling both stud and competition requirements.
5. Prices for stallions and mares (of any breed) should be higher then geldings and sterilized mares. Only because breeding animals can produce many foals in their lives making them more expensive!
6. This idea needs to be looked over many times to make sure that it is fun, fair and easily worked with for players or it could become very frustrating if you can't afford any stallion showing classes so you can get titles for your best horse.
My only concern is for it to be fun and fair. As well as been a game enhancer, not a limiter. Also the penalties may be unnecessary and a sad detraction from the game. If these things are met, I look forward with great interest to the arrival of geldings!!!
Thank you,
Honeybunny
P.S. This is my opinion not fully researched facts. And most is based on the experiences I have had. Others may have had different experiences. I hold a Bachelors degree in Animal Science and I am a equine vet. But I don't even think I know everything! So experiences differ. These are just my observations and the things I have noticed!
P.P.S. One of the main risks with the sterilizing procedure is the fact that the mare must be under anesthesia which is risky in large animals and equines!
That makes sense. Maybe the personality and temperament can play more of a roll? For example: a bombproof, 'sweet' (if a new base personality is added) stallion can be handled completely by level three; however, a highly strung, 'aggressive' stallion can only be handled at level twenty.
I get the whole not wanting penalties; and I both want to agree with you and I also don't... I'm not sure how to explain it. Like... let's take The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim.
So, in Skyrim, there's a thing called a Thu'um, essentially, Shouting to change the make up of the universe to your own will. Lore-wise (some of this is speculation (theoretically, a Thu'um can do anything (this isn't, however, explicitly stated (to my knowledge))), one can Shout continuously - one can slow time to a halt, run with the speed of a whirlwind, emblazon one's blade with the fury of the elements, make oneself intangible. Game-wise (in unmodded Skyrim and when one doesn't use cheats), there is a cool-down period between Shouts that depends on which Thu'um one uses as well as the number of words in the Thu'um (Shouts are made of a maximum of three words and syllables with one exception). One can slow time (but not stop it), sprint a one-hundred metres maximum in less than a second, sharpen and quicken one's blade(s) (as long as it isn't enchanted) and make it so that one can neither harm nor be harmed (but one can't pass through solid objects.) You can reduce Shout cool down (but not eliminate) by about 20% by wearing an Amulet of Talos.
Why is game-play so different from lore? Why is the Thu'um nerfed? The differences, the penalties, keep the game challenging and interesting. They give further goals and penalties. It's getting as close as possible to realism whilst still trying to keep it fair. One can't have something super powerful in a game without giving it a penalty.
If neutering has either a negative or no effect on the horse, it reduces the number of neutered horses. If neutering is only done to stop the horse breeding, then it would likely be because the horse's genes are bad; if the horse is too bad to breed and too bad to compete, why even have them at all? What value will geldings have?
The bonuses and penalties I suggested are to allow two options: low risk with consistent, moderate reward and high risk with inconsistent, high reward.
PS: I just want to make it clear - I'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to explain my way of seeing it.
PPS: Also, quick question, in your first post on this topic, you called yourself a 'young teen' and then you said you have a Bachelors degree in Animal Science and are an equine vet? I'm simply confused about the inconsistency in those statements.
PPPS: I don't feel like finding the references for the Skyrim stuff; if you're into Skyrim and you want the references, ask and I'll find them.
Sorry for the confusion... I was a young teen when I was activly riding my stallion Warrior... he is 25 and semi retired and I am 25 too. LOL I see where you were confused!
Re: Geldings, additional courses, new 'personality'
That makes sense now! Thanks for clearing that up.honeybunny wrote: "Also, quick question, in your first post on this topic, you called yourself a 'young teen' and then you said you have a Bachelors degree in Animal Science and are an equine vet? I'm simply confused about the inconsistency in those statements."
Sorry for the confusion... I was a young teen when I was activly riding my stallion Warrior... he is 25 and semi retired and I am 25 too. LOL I see where you were confused!